Twitter dialogue between…
Fania Oz-Salzbarger [“Mom, Israeli, Jewish, humanist, History prof. Loving daughter of Amos Oz. Tel Aviv U (BA, MA), Oxford U (D.Phil), Uppsala U (Dr. h.c) Democracy must win.”]
&
Ambassador Majed Bamya [“Deputy Permanent Observer of the State of Palestine to the UN, New York. Palestinian from Yaffa. Refugee. The time for freedom is always right now!”]
FOS: Let’s talk about the Bataclan massacre. Imagine that on 13 November 2015, the terrorists would enter the nightclub accompanied by their extended families. Imagine that apart from killing 60 innocents and injuring 416, they would also take 250 hostages. Then they hole up in the building, using their women and children, as well as the hostages, as human shields. Then they begin to murder the hostages one by one, airing videos of them tortured and begging for their lives. All the while, they also shoot rockets into Paris, causing the evacuation of the city. If you imagined all that, can you also imagine the French police or army not storming the place, to the detriment of the elderly, women and children held in the building? I cannot. (And apology to my French followers for raising that horrific memory).
10:23 AM · Jan 18, 2024
MB: What an unfortunate analogy to justify the unjustifiable. This is wrong on so many levels. But I know that you know that already. This is not an intellectual exercise. Tens of thousands of people, children, infants are being killed. It is not debate camp. We should all be writing with that in mind and be more responsible.
2:22 PM · Jan 17, 2024
FOS: Ambassador, I lament every innocent killed in Gaza. More than that, they will always be a burden on my conscience. But do tell: what is wrong with my analogy?
3:11 PM · Jan 17, 2024
MB: 1st you know this assault is not about releasing the Israelis held captive. So why pretend it is?
2nd, if you are making this analogy then you should say that the French police would bomb the building, the neighborhood and maybe even destroy Paris. They would not. But maybe that is because as an occupying Power, the Israeli government has no regard for Palestinian lives and rights and considers it okay to destroy entire cities and kill tens of thousands of Palestinians, half of them children, with some Israeli leaders openly advocating for annihilation and others advocating for ethnic cleansing.
3rd, if you can find justification for the killing of so many Palestinian civilians don’t you think somebody can do the same intellectual exercise you did and find an analogy to justify the killing of Israeli civilians. Shouldn’t we strive to end this cycle rather than sustain it? It would make more sense to plead and act for an end to the killing, for release of those held captive (how many thousands of Palestinians are held captive, how many thousands were abducted in recent weeks), for Palestinian and Israeli families to be reunited in life rather than death, for an end of the siege and the occupation, for peace. I believe in a future of freedom for the Palestinian people and shared peace and security and I try to write and act accordingly. And since you speak of peace I did not expect to see you write to justify mass killing of Palestinians.
4:29 PM · Jan 17, 2024
FOS: Dear Ambassador, thanks for the ongoing respectful debate. I feel your genuine pain. I agree about the horrible civilian toll in Gaza, and sadly assume that some of the IDF bombing and shooting is indiscriminate. Please bear with me on the following:
* Israel delayed its assault on Gaza 3 weeks, among other purposes to allow negotiations. Why didn’t Hamas agree to negotiate bona fide? What alternative did we have to try to rescue our 250 abductees? Fact: 108 were released by a ceasefire following military pressure.
* Would you consider the Hamas leadership useful for Palestinians and beneficial for the cause of freeing Palestine? I know you cannot answer this one. I just hope that deep in your heart you are thinking about it.
* You mentioned freedom and peace for Palestinians. I couldn’t agree more. But since you didn’t mention Israel, I wonder whether we are included in the vision.
Inshallah. Salamat. Fania
10:23 AM · Jan 18, 2024
MB: The Israelis held captive were released in an exchange with the release of Palestinian prisoners. The thousands of Palestinians killed had nothing to do with that outcome. And now after tens of thousands of Palestinians killed and destruction and devastation beyond imagination in Gaza and tens of Israelis held captive killed by Israeli fire how can anyone still believe in the myth of “military pressure” (the code name for mass atrocities). I persist that the only reason we did not see a ceasefire and release of people held captive is that an end of this assault would be prejudicial to the political survival of Netanyahu.
Since you ask what I believe in, there is a sentence Arafat said decades ago: live and let live. That is what I believe in. Our freedom will lead to shared peace and security. Ending the occupation and achieving Palestinian independence and having peace between the State of Palestine and Israel. It may look increasingly delusional but the alternative is what we have now, so I feel it is worth a fight. You wrote several times about your opposition to settlements and the need to dismantle them and your support for the two-State solution. That is why I am taking the time to write. Because if we believe in peace we have to oppose this assault and the mass killing of civilians (the 2.3 million people who are feeling this assault in their flesh are those you want to live in peace with!) and support release of people held captive on both sides, an end to the Israeli occupation, mutual recognition and shared peace and security.
11:46 AM · Jan 18, 2024
FOS: We disagree about the urgent need to defeat Hamas by force (since I don’t see it achieved by any other means). Israel’s war in Gaza is not a cover name for atrocities or, heaven forbid, genocide. It is an ugly, dirty, totally unwanted war, but at its base I am afraid it is a just war. I also sadly don’t envisage ‘warm’ peace between Israelis and Gazans, not all Palestinians but Gazans. 7/10 was an enormous game changer even for the Left. What we can hope for is a territorial agreement with the horizon of a Palestinian state and a slow, painful reinvention of mutual trust. Nevertheless, you and I agree on much. We share a hope. Next time I am in New York, or you come in peace to visit your hometown of Yaffa/Yaffo, may I invite you to a cup of good coffee?
12:24 PM · Jan 18, 2024
MB: I will retain hope that one day in the near future you will see how unjust this war is, how atrocious it is. Or there is no hope. And I will ask you a question from one human being to another, because you see us as equals, right? If I was writing to justify massacres against Israeli civilians for any reason, releasing our prisoners, ending the siege, removing the settlements, stopping settler attacks, freeing our country, (and there are always reasons and Palestinians have so many reasons), would you accept my invite to meet and talk regardless how many things we have in common? I doubt it. If you think your security allows what is happening to my people in Gaza, we fundamentally disagree on the path regardless how much we agree on the destination, and that is a fundamental problem as the price of that disagreement is thousands of Palestinians, and of Palestinian children killed. The worst is that this method will never bring security. Only peace can. I know saying that in Israel today would be very complicated. But why are we Palestinians expected to say these things even as our people are being slaughtered and should not expect the same from Israelis. In history it is usually the society of the colonizing power that has the large peace movement, not the society of the colonized. Only in Palestine and Israel the expectation is reversed. I wish you and your loved ones well. Wish me and my loved ones well, including my loved ones under the bombs in Gaza. And that necessarily means being against the bombs falling on their heads. Nothing justifies doing this to 2.3 million people, trust me on that. Live and let live.
3:21 PM · Jan 18, 2024
FOS: So you decline my invitation. Respectfully noted. To your question: if you justified massacre of my people, I would say no. If you made the other points — prisoners, liberty etc. — I would say yes. You know, as human to human: one of my sons read our correspondence. He was shocked to see that while I repeatedly sympathised with the suffering of Gazan civilians, you never wrote a word about the horror of 7/10. No shock, no empathy, no consolation. Are you that blind to your enemies’ human pain? No, I would never justify a massacre of your civilian and innocent people. I wonder why you have nothing to say about the atrocious mass murder and rape of mine.
4:58 PM · Jan 18, 2024
MB: How can’t you see that justifying this war is justifying the massacres against my people, while it is a war of massacres? I recognize the pain and suffering of every father, mother, sibling, son, daughter, grandfather, grandmother, grandson and granddaughter who had a loved one killed or held captive or still held captive and I hope that everyone will have in their heart the honesty to say that if they feel what they endured was terrible that they should not wish it on anyone else. A long time ago I learnt the name of Smadar Elhanan (we would have been the same age today) when she was killed in an explosion by a Palestinian. Her parents’ dedication to Palestinian freedom and peace despite their child being killed (or even with more resolve since) touched my heart and changed my perception forever. There is a future where no Palestinian and no Israeli is killed. Nothing justifies postponing it. When I say I want peace I mean it. But wanting peace can never mean accepting that Palestine remains occupied or that our people continue to be oppressed. It must be about freedom, justice, equality. It is time for all of us to say enough. Do the words we exchanged in the worst of times matter? Only time will tell. For now, each one of us has choices to make. Actions to undertake. And maybe one day we will be convinced that there is only one way forward and we need to embark on it with resolve.
6:07 PM · Jan 18, 2024
FOS: Seriously: you want us to leave Hamas untouched? To let them continue to rule Gaza? Doesn’t that amount to spitting in the face of the butchered and raped, in the face of the survivors who can’t continue their lives, in the face of decent people worldwide? I visited Gaza in the 1970s and 1980s. Lovely people hosted me. They worked together with the kibbutzniks, planned a future together, spoke of neighboring states and even a federation. What has Hamas done to Gaza? And, as diplomats and writers agree, words matter. Please don’t just lament innocent deaths in the universe. Spare a moment to grieve for 7/10. If I can do it for Khan Younes, you can do it for Nir Oz.